Posted by Dawud on June 20, 2101 at 17:31:04:

In Reply to: Re: Baha'i historical sites in Turkey...? posted by Rob on June 20, 2101 at 11:54:20:

Thanks again--I've written the Turkish Baha'is, so presumably they'll let me know if I need to get permission from Haifa.

For comparison, in Israel non-Baha'is (and non-Haifa Baha'is) are allowed to go to the sites in Haifa and Akka anytime, while (Haifa) Baha'is have to apply, even if they're not going on pilgrimage. On the other hand more people know about the sites in Israel--especially now. (Hey, put some artificial snow on them gardens, guys, and a ski lift!) Also I believe there was a British-era court decisions ordering the Haifa Baha'is to allow visits. The decision was in settlement of a dispute between the followers of Abdu'l-Baha and Muhammad Ali, each of whom wanted to secure the sites for themselves, and bar the other group. (Baha'i family dynamics back then would make the Nepalese royal house look like a model of stability.)

As far as I know, nothing said even by the radical side at Badasht would have definitely separated the Babis from Islam, any more than occurred with the Ahmadiyyah or the Sudanese Mahdist movement. The Bab claimed the right to abrogate Islamic law, and some sort of very high station, but his followers saw this as consistent with Shi'i (esp. Shaykyi) millennarian traditions. In their eyes, Babism wasn't post-Islamic, it was *true* Islam. When Baha'is started making converts among Jews and Zoroastrians in Iran, they established separate communities with their own customary law. Also, prior to World War II interested Westerners often kept their regular religious affiliation on the assumption that the Baha'i religion was an ecumenical society, or perhaps a mystical order like Theosophy. Some clergymen even joined! Until recently Europeans and Persians were held to different behavioral requirements viz. the Aqdas, presumably for these historical and communal reasons.

Anybody know about the sites in Istanbul, as opposed to Edirne?

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